The Virtual STS Centre on MediaMOO presents:

A FORUM ON THE USE OF VIRTUAL SPACES FOR WORK-RELATED INTERACTION
IN THE HUMANITIES

April 23, 1993

transcript prepared by Wade Roush
"Wade" @ MediaMOO
Internet: weroush@athena.mit.edu

*******************************************************************
The following is an electronic transcript of a group discussion that
occurred in the Autumn and Summer Conference Rooms of the Virtual
Science and Technology Studies Centre on MediaMOO (telnet address:
purple-crayon.media.mit.edu 8888) on April 23, 1993.
Permission is granted to reproduce this transcript for academic
purposes, provided that its existing content is not modified in any way.
*******************************************************************

Autumn Conference Room

    A warm, sunny room with a table and plenty of chairs. Outside, the trees
along Memorial Drive are a verdant green and pleasure boats are skittering
across the Charles River. A warm breeze enters through an open window.
 
Obvious exits: out to STS Centre 2nd Level Hall
Wade, cdr, G.W., Ralph124C41, Oracle, Daniel, Pierre, and Molly are standing
here.
You see Plaque Showing How to Use This Room, video camera #2, and Forum
Questions Poster here.


Oracle says [about this is being taped], ":-D"
Daniel [to Wade]: "Is the forum going on in both rooms at once, or will it move
from one place to another?"
Oracle says, "test""
cdr [to Wade]: ill put some donuts and coffee out in the hall if thats ok..
Wade [to Daniel]: I think we'll move to the other room later if the feeling of
the meeting is that we should try out the council room.
Wade [to Daniel]: I thought we should start here since it's a little simpler.
Wade [to cdr]: Please do!
cdr goes out.
Daniel nods.  "Also, I brought a camera to zoom in on people, since cdr won't
be here.  Hope that's okay."
Daniel meant that cdr's cameras won't be able to do that.
cdr has arrived.
Azure_Guest has arrived.
Striped_Guest has arrived.
Oracle goes out.
G.W. says, "cdr, are your tapes going to be available?"
Ralph124C41 waves to the guests
Oracle has arrived.
cdr [to G.W.]: the tapes will be edited and made publicaly available in the
MMTV studio library for playing anytime over tv sets..
Wade [to Daniel]: That's okay, but if everyone starts bringing cameras we're
going to have a database problem!
Yellow Cab drives in.
Oracle mixes with the growing crowd
Wintermute opens the door of the cab and steps out.
Orange_Guest has arrived.
Oracle takes another bite of our yummy mooberry croissant. . .
Oracle polishes off our yummy mooberry croissant.
Oracle takes another sip of coffee. .
Ralph124C41  wonders if it's a no=host bar.
Oracle yups.
Orange_Guest pulls up a chair.
Oracle sits down on the chair.
Oracle takes another sip of coffee. .
Azure_Guest goes out.
cdr says, "we better keep the donut eaters out..ha ha :)"
G.W. has disconnected.
The cab drives out.
Ninja_Librarian has arrived.
Oracle takes another sip of coffee. .
Oracle will be finished in a second.
Wade says [about Food & Drinks], "There's no waiter here; you can go up to the
rooftop cafe for that."
Guest has arrived.
Wade waves everyone.
cdr turns on camera to begin recording. . .
Wintermute [to Wade]: Hi, Wade.  How long before this thing starts?
Wade [to Wintermute]: About five minutes
cdr goes out.
Striped_Guest sits down on the sofa.
Daniel drops Handycam.
cdr has arrived.
Wade sits down on the sofa.
Flame_Guest has arrived.
Flame_Guest goes out.
Flame_Guest has arrived.
Daniel turns on camera to begin recording. . .
Molly has disconnected.
Ninja_Librarian [to cdr]: Do we have an MMTV Guide now?
Ralph124C41 waves to all the guests.
Oracle stands up from the chair.
Daniel pans the camera left and right over Summer Conference Room. . .
Wade [to Ninja_Librarian]: cdr just stepped out!
Oracle sits down on the sofa.
cdr [to Ninja_Librarian]: yes!  just  type    'schedule <tvname>'   
Orange_Guest waves at the camera.
Wade [to cdr]: Oops -- cancel that.
Daniel zooms the camera in on Wade. . .
Wintermute sits down on the chair.
Striped_Guest stands up from the sofa.
Striped_Guest goes out.
Wade combs his hair hurriedly.
Striped_Guest has arrived.
Ninja_Librarian consults the tv schedule. .
cdr [to Wade]: gotta run now..good luck! bye
Ralph124C41 says, "bye cdr"
Wade [to cdr]: Bye -- come back later if you have time.
cdr goes out.
ELF materializes out of thin air.
Flame_Guest takes seat 
Sharp shouts, "Hey everyone! The Forum on the Use of Virtual Spaces in the
Humanities will begin shortly in the Summer Conference Room of the Virtual STS
Centre."
The housekeeper arrives to cart G.W. off to bed.
Striped_Guest goes out.
Sparkle has arrived.
tonami materializes out of thin air.
adamfast has arrived.
Daniel zooms the camera in on Forum Questions Poster. . .
Turquoise_Guest has arrived.
Der_Wanderer has arrived.
Ralph124C41 sits down on the sofa.
tonami sits cross-legged on the floor.
tonami stands up from the floor.
Wade says, "We'll wait just a couple more minutes for late-comers and then
we'll get started!"
Peter materializes out of thin air.
Turquoise_Guest says, "while we're waiting can anyone tell me about getting a
characther?  I sent the required stuff via email yesterday, but don't have a
passwerored"
tonami to Ninja_Librarian:  Hey, it's good to see another librarian ...
Ninja_Librarian [to tonami]: Nice to meet you. Pitts_Librarian showed me the
Infocenter today.
The housekeeper arrives to cart Molly off to bed.
Wade [to Turquoise_Guest]: I'm sure someone will answer your request shortly,
by Monday at the latest.
Der_Wanderer puts the remaining minutes to use by doing some urgent RL admin
works...
Wintermute [to Turquoise_Guest]: It sometimes takes a couple days.  Mine took
about 48 hours.
Turquoise_Guest says, "thanks! Thought that was probably it!"
PaulB materializes out of thin air.
ELF sits cross-legged on the floor.
Ninja_Librarian [to Turquoise_Guest]: Who will you be?
Wade bangs an imaginary gavel on the table loudly. BANG BANG BANG!
Peter [to PaulB]: Hi. You taping this?
Indigo_Guest has arrived.
Indigo_Guest takes another bite of its tasty apple turnover. . .
Wade says, "Okay, everyone, this is not going to be very structured, but I want
to start things off by welcoming everyone. Thanks for coming!"
PaulB says, "My camera is having problems...."
Wintermute stands up from the chair.
Wintermute disappears suddenly for parts unknown.
Der_Wanderer starts clapping his hands
adamfast has disconnected.
tonami claps
Flame_Guest applauds
Indigo_Guest polishes off its tasty apple turnover.
Wade says, "My thought was that we could talk in this room for about half the
meeting and then move across the hall to the Autumn Conference Room, in order
to try out the Council program."
Turquoise_Guest whistles and stomps!
Rik has arrived.
Der_Wanderer  mumbles approval
Peter consults the manual for Peter's Camera.
Peter removes Peter's tape from Peter's Camera.
Wade says, "Please see the Forum Questions Poster here to get an idea of what
we'll be discussing today!"
Peter puts tape3 in Peter's Camera.
Eric has arrived.
Der_Wanderer waves at eric!
Peter drops Peter's Camera.
Peter turns on camera to begin recording. . .
Wade says, "And please read the Plaque for instructions on using the 'about'
function in this room!"
Eric waves at Der Wanderer
Peter consults the manual for Peter's Camera.
Wade says [about The About Function], "You can use the about function to label
a string of the conversation this way."
Peter pans the camera left and right over Summer Conference Room. . .
Der_Wanderer [to eric] "xcuse me for a couple of secs, I got this vital e-amil
to finish...
adamfast has connected.
adamfast goes out.
Wade says [about The About Function], "That way we can keep track of
many-threaded conversations more easily. Or that is the idea, anyway -- we'll
see if it really works."
Peter zooms the camera in on Wade. . .
Paulie materializes out of thin air.
Wade says [about The About Function], "Whose Handycam is flashing?"
adamfast has arrived.
Peter zooms the camera in on Plaque Showing How to Use This Room. . .
Wintermute has arrived.
Daniel [to Wade]: "That's mine, why?
Teal_Guest has arrived.
Flame_Guest says [about The About Function], "Do we have to change the about
evertime we change topics?"
Sparkle goes out.
Turquoise_Guest says, "do you type "say about...." or "about... first , then
your says?"
Daniel stops handycam.
Daniel removes DanTape 0 from Handycam.
Wade [to Daniel]: I just wanted to make sure it wasn't cdr's/
tonami says [about about sounds good], "about The About Function "It sounds
good"
Der_Wanderer  supposes you say "about xxx " first, then say yyyy (or just
"yyyy)
Wade [to turquouise]: Read the plaque for instructions.
Molly materializes out of thin air.
Wintermute sits down on the chair.
Peter [to Wade]: I don't know who's doing the official tape. But I have a tape
from cdr in my camera taping the proceedings.
Flame_Guest says [about The About Function], "What will our first about topic
be?"
Daniel puts DRTape1 in Handycam.
Turquoise_Guest says, "how bout barriers? Q1."
Daniel turns on camera to begin recording. . .
Wade announces, "Everyone should know that the talk today is being taped for
posterity by several people. Transcripts should be available later for those
who are interested."
Victor_L materializes out of thin air.
Turquoise_Guest nods approvingly
Eric says, "howdy Victor"
adamfast says [about this conference], "how about the use of MOOs in
universities? (this is the first formal meeting i've heard of.)"
Victor_L says, "Hello, Eric"
Oracle says [about conference format], "I suggest each discussion question
should be spoken aloud..."
Wade says, "I'd like to start things off by asking people to say (BRIEFLY)
where they are from!"
Turquoise_Guest says [about barriers], "based on two times here, I've got a
barrier!"
Wade is from MIT, where he's a doctoral student in Science, Technology, and
Society.
Peter is from the University of Cape Town, Cape Town, South Africa.
Pink_Guest has arrived.
adamfast says [about this conference], "i'm from the department of technical
communication, university of washington, settle was"
tonami is from Penn State where she's a librarian
Flame_Guest says, "Flame_Guest is from Vanderbilt Univ."
Daniel zooms the camera in on Peter. . .
Daniel zooms the camera in on tonami. . .
Peter is a 3rd (final) year student in Computer Science.
Turquoise_Guest is secretary in the MN Cetner for Philosophy of Science
Guest is really tina from brandeis u, phd sociology pet
Wintermute is from UC Berkeley, and is a postdoc in history of science.
Ninja_Librarian is a reference librarian in Washington, D.C.
Ralph124C41  is a phd student at ucla in library information/science
Guest oops dept :)
Indigo_Guest  is from UCLA in EE
Molly says, "I'm from the University of Maryland."
Orange_Guest says, "is from Boston and works at TASC on 3D computer graphics."
Flame_Guest is in the tech. transfer dept. of Vanderbilt
Daniel is a research scientist at Apple Computer.
Oracle is a Cyberspace Researcher from Palo Alto. He was a co-author of
Lucasfilm'S Habitat. He was it's first Oracle (Janitor).
ELF is from McGill (Ph.D. Sociology)
Pierre says, "Pierre is from Sherbrooke, Quebec.          "
Rik is from Martin Marietta in Denver, and is a software engineer it various
stuff.
PaulB says [about me], "I'm a professor of Mass communication at a small
college in Iowa"
Daniel zooms the camera in on Wintermute. . .
Blue_Guest has arrived.
Daniel zooms the camera in on Ninja_Librarian. . .
Eric is from the university of missouri,usa, doctoral student in rhetoric and
writing technologies
Paulie says, "I'm in Information Science at the University of Pittsburgh"
Daniel zooms the camera in on Ralph124C41. . .
Victor_L is a undergraduate in English and American Literature/Computer Science
at New College in Florida
Ralph124C41  smiles
Pink_Guest says, ""
Der_Wanderer is from the Austrian Research Institute for Artificial
Intelligence, Vienna, Austria, EUROPE! ;-)
Daniel zooms the camera in on Molly. . .
PaulB remarks on the number of camras here today. is amazed
Pink_Guest says, ""pink guest is a M.a. from Bowling Green in Popular culture"
Wade says, "Thanks for introducing yourselves! Perhaps we should start the
discussion with the most basic question: Are MUDs now, or are they ever going
to be, genuinely useful for work-related interaction in the humanities?"
Striped_Guest has arrived.
Eric says, "another English dept. person, hurray!"
Victor_L drops Video Camera.
Striped_Guest sits cross-legged on the floor.
Wade says, "The floor is open to anyone who wants to speak up!"
Guest says, "i've gotten to speak with several people i wouldn't have met
otherwise"
Peter says [about Mud usefulness], "Wade, we must seperate that question into a
number of topics."
Wade [to Peter]: Please do!
Victor_L consults the manual for Video Camera.
Pink_Guest says, "why not just use IRC"
Flame_Guest says [about MUDS], "I think until more people discover one another
electronically connections such as this one won't be made"
Oracle says [about MUD/MOO interaction quality], "Typing is a terrible
interface for this sort of interaction."
Victor_L turns on camera to begin recording. . .
Daniel zooms the camera in on Oracle. . .
Ninja_Librarian says [about MUDs], "It's certainly more interesting than a
bulletin board."
Turquoise_Guest says [about useful muds], "i agree with oracle.  At least so
far here..."
Wade [to Pink_Guest]: What is IRC?
Oracle says [about MUD/MOO interaction quality], "What does a MOO bring to the
table?"
Flame_Guest says [about quality], "yes, but it is much cheaper than satellite
tech"
Pink_Guest says, "to wade Internet Relay Chat"
tonami says [about MUD/MOO interactions], "MOO's bring a context, I think"
Wade nods.
Peter says [about Mud usefulness], "Basically, we must consider the MUD from
two perspectives. 1) As a medium of connecting people. 2) As a medium for
having on MUD activities."
adamfast says [about MUDs], "muds are useful to chat in realtime..."
Flame_Guest says [about quality], "plus it allow for the creation of objects
and permanent rooms"
Teal_Guest says, "interactions are like dancing with a partner who is hearing a
different beat"
Eric says [about MUD usefulness], "IRC is mighty useful too, but MUD/MOOs offer
a different, maybe homelier? atmosphere that might be very helpful"
Wade says [about quality], "One thing a MUD brings is a playful atmosphere. I'm
not sure whether that is all to the good!"
Molly looks forward to having split-screen graphics with MUD commentary.
Daniel says [about richness of MUDs], "MUDs give a sense of place missing from
other online forums."
Oracle idles (needs to eat lunch in RL).
Peter says [about Mud usefulness], "Wade, I disagree to a certain extent."
Flame_Guest says [about muds], "I agree with daniel"
Rik says, ""a MUD seems to change the emphasis of a computer environment from
that of the data, to that of the people."
Sherrie materializes out of thin air.
Turquoise_Guest says [about useful muds], "playfulness is good when you want to
play, but..."
Wade agrees with Daniel.
Ralph124C41 says, "but of what importance is having a sense of place?"
Pink_Guest says, "agrees with turqoise guest"
Wintermute [to Rik]: Intersting idea.  Could you expand on that?
Peter says [about Mud usefulness], "Consider that IRC is MUCH more playful than
a Mud. The aura of work, of worth in construction and maintainance stabilises
things."
adamfast agrees with Daniel
PaulB says [about MUD utility], "here's an interesting irony. cdr and I are
colleagues on the same campus. But this MOO has provided us with a means for
interaction that we never had before. We've intereacted as much or more than
IRL."
Daniel says [about richness of MUDs], "It allows for building places that are
'personalized' for an individual or (even more) a community."
Eric says [about MUD use], "to wade: I think playfulness is terribly
undervalued in the academy-- heck it might be a real breakthru to PLAY"
Wade [to Peter]: I would like to hear you expand your critique. I'm also very
ambivalent about usefulness, but I'm eager to hear what others think.
Daniel turns off the camera. . .
Peter says [about Mud usefulness], "I agree with Daniel"
Wade [to Eric]: Absolutely!
Daniel removes DRTape1 from Handycam.
Flame_Guest says [about muds], "IRC is s playground, a MUD can be a workroom as
long as participants agree to keep it as such"
Turquoise_Guest says [about useful muds], "I think it's potentially very good,
but I agree with oracle that the interface is REALLY hurting!"
Pink_Guest says, "I think the same is true of IRC"
Eric says, "while we work."
Daniel puts drtape2 in Handycam.
Pink_Guest sits cross-legged on the floor.
Rik says, "Yes. Now that we are connected to other work environements, it is no
longer me and my data.  So the MUD is part of this change of paradigm."
Peter says [about Mud usefulness], "Wade: which critique? Things go too
fast..."
Flame_Guest says [about muds], "to Turqoise: Have you tried IRC"
Guest has disconnected.
Wade says [about quality], "What sorts of improvements would make the interface
less annoying?"
Der_Wanderer [>]: oracle, turquoise, pink etc.: You must not confuse the
shortcoming's of todays clients with the true potential of the MOO idea!
Peter says [about Mud usefulness], "Wade, how about a better client?"
Turquoise_Guest says [about useful muds], "to der_wanderer...agreed!"
Striped_Guest stands up from the floor.
Pink_Guest says, "this interface is really bad"
adamfast says [about improvements], "need a client that separates threads of
conversation from the user input"
tonami says [about interfaces], "It would help if the interface would sort out
each participants comments into "
Molly says, "I believe the VIRTUAL sense of place helps transcend many real
barriers in international /inter-gender /interdisciplinary interactions."
Striped_Guest goes out.
Wade [to Peter]: You said you disagreed with me about the usefulness of MUDs.
I'm not sure I agree with myself! I'd like to hear you articulate your
reservations.
tonami says [about interfaces], "its own window"
Rik is pulled out of the conference my irate co-workers.
Eric says [about IRC v MUD], "IRC -can- accommodate focused work, too. I've
seen it happen, but you're right, it's a bit less likely."
Rik goes out.
Peter says [about Improving MUDs], "Consider that everything works on a line by
line level now. We need to expand beyond that."
Daniel says [about MUD interface], "I'm not sure I agree entirely with Turq.
There's something really vivid about text in the same way that novels are often
better than their movies."
PaulB says [about interface], "I agree with Amy that the low bandwidth is
probably the biggest limiting factor. I'm not sure improved interfaces can help
too much. the bandwidth represnets a glass ceiling here."
adamfast looks confused
Wade [to Molly]: I agree!
Pink_Guest says, "I believe cyberspace in itself does not need these
preconstructed realities"
Flame_Guest says [about muds], "Has anyone seen the Jayhouse MUD which also
includes Gopher clients?"
adamfast tries to concentrate on one thread
Daniel nods to Flame_Guest.
adamfast says [about improvements], "!!!where is jayhouse"
Turquoise_Guest says [about useful muds], "to daniel It's not text per se I'm
objecting to, it's the way it's flashing hurly-burly across my screen!"
Wade [to Pink_Guest]: Please explain further.
tonami says [about muds], "I've seen the JH gopher"
adamfast agrees with turquoise
Daniel smiles at Turq's reply.
Wade [to Flame_Guest]: There are gopher slates on MediaMOO also.
Eric says [about clients], "IS there a client for VM/CMS systems? The interface
and its ease of use can be critical, esp. for new users"
Pink_Guest says, "it just ends up becoming the same hegemonic type world that
is created"
Peter says [about MUD usefullness], "Well, let me make myself clear. 1: MUD is
helluva useful in terms of connection. I have met and talked to people who are
in my own field, and have got in contact with people in my own country I did
not even know of."
adamfast says [about improvements], "where are the gopher slates....? i'll look
later"
Peter says [about MUD usefullness], "2: MUD does not seem particularly good in
terms of getting people to work. If you can sit and talk, you might as
well...."
Flame_Guest says [about mediaMoo], "Can email be sent from MediaMOO to the
Internet"
Der_Wanderer says [about interfaces], "I can see not fundamental reason why MUD
clients could not be extended to include some layout information in a graphical
way in the near future: e.g. lining out rooms with characters positioned at
certain locations and kind of "speech bubbles" connected to them ..."
Pink_Guest says, "I still don't understand what the usefullness of the created
environment is????"
Wade says [about Interfaces], "One problem may be that there are too many
people talking at once. I don't mean to shut anyone up -- I'm just observing
that the conversation might be more coherent if we were using a different
moderating scheme, like the Council room."
Eric says [about bandwidth], "is NREN and NII going to affect bandwidth
available in the future, you reckon?"
Der_Wanderer agrees to wade's comment
Wintermute says [about muds], "I agree with Peter: the greatest thing about
this sytem right now, despite interface problems, are the opportunities for
MEETING people.  But it has little usefulness other than that right now."
Wade [to Eric]: That's a good question, other's have asked that too...
Turquoise_Guest says [about useful muds], "I agree with Wanderer...would that I
were a programmer!"
adamfast thought
Peter says [about MUD usefullness], "Wade: Yes, this is not quite working. Can
we somehow queue topics?"
Wade [to adamfast]: send me mail later about gopher.
Blue_Guest goes out.
adamfast suggests we go to the autumn room...
Pink_Guest says, "I have done a great deal of research through contacts on IRC"
Ralph124C41 agrees with adamfast
Flame_Guest says, "Can we go to Autumn Room and use Parliamentary Procedure?"
Networker materializes out of thin air.
Wade says [about Interfaces], "LET's VOTE! How many people would like to try
out the Autumn Room?"
tonami yes
Wade raises his hand
Der_Wanderer votes yes
Peter says [about MUD usefullness], "Let me MAKE A STATMENT as a person from
South Africa. In South Africa I am very much isolated from my community of
peers. Our department is small. Networking, and particularly mudding allows me
to connect with my peers...."
Turquoise_Guest says [about useful muds], "yes"
Molly votesd for autumn
Pink_Guest says, "1 here"
Orange_Guest says, "yea"
Peter votes yes.
Flame_Guest votes for Autmn
Ralph124C41 says, "yes"
Wintermute votes for the Autum room.
Indigo_Guest says [about MUD/MOO interactions], "yes"
adamfast votes yes for autumn
Ninja_Librarian says [about MUDs], "Lets go "
Indigo_Guest goes out.
PaulB says [about interface], "{to Eric} yes, bandwidth will only increase"
Der_Wanderer goes out.
Molly goes out.
ELF  votes for autumn room             
Pink_Guest stands up from the floor.
Pink_Guest goes out.
adamfast goes out.
Flame_Guest goes out.
tonami goes out.
Wade [to Peter]: That's very interesting!
Turquoise_Guest goes out.
Orange_Guest goes out.
Ninja_Librarian goes out.
Eric goes out.
ELF stands up from the floor.
ELF goes out.
Peter turns off the camera. . .
Wade stands up from the sofa.
Wade goes out.
Sherrie disappears suddenly for parts unknown.
Peter says [about MUD usefullness], "See ya in Autumn folks"
PaulB goes out.
Pierre goes out.
Peter picks up Peter's Camera.
Peter goes out.
Victor_L turns off the camera. . .
Victor_L picks up Video Camera.
Networker goes out.
Redeen materializes out of thin air.
>out

The door swishes open and you step into the hall. 
STS Centre 2nd Level Hall
    A carpeted hall space that looks a bit like the corridors on the USS
Enterprise, NCC 1701-D. At the center of the hallway a spiral staircase
descends to the lobby below and ascends to the 3rd level. At each of the four
corners are doors to customized conference rooms labeled Spring, Summer,
Autumn, and Winter.

Obvious exits: down to STS Centre Lounge, spring to Spring Conference Room,
summer to Summer Conference Room, autumn to Autumn Conference Room, winter to
Winter Conference Room, and up to STS Centre 3rd Level Hall
You see Sign Explaining Conference Rooms, Pot of Hot Coffee, and Box of Fresh
Donuts! here.
Sherrie is here.

>aut
The door swishes open and you step into the conference room.

Autumn Conference Room
    A mellow, comfortable room with lots of sofas and couches. Outside, the
trees along Memorial Drive are a luminous golden color, and whitecaps are
showing on the windswept Charles River Basin. The faint odour of burning leaves
drifts in through an open window.
 
Obvious exits: out to STS Centre 2nd Level Hall
You see Moderating Rules, Plaque Showing How to Use This Room, video camera #1,
Forum Questions Poster, and Peter's Camera here.

Indigo_Guest, Molly, Der_Wanderer, adamfast, Turquoise_Guest, Pink_Guest,
Orange_Guest, tonami, Wade, Ninja_Librarian, PaulB, Blue_Guest, ELF, Peter,
Eric, Networker, Pierre, and Flame_Guest are here.

Peter pans the camera left and right over Autumn Conference Room. . .
Wade says, "I have appointed myself moderator for the time being!"
Peter zooms the camera in on Plaque Showing How to Use This Room. . .
Ralph124C41 materializes out of thin air.
Der_Wanderer says, "technical aside: does the "threading" work in this room,
too?"
Teal_Guest has arrived.
Indigo_Guest says, "Der, no. I don't think so."
Wintermute has arrived.
Victor_L has arrived.
Sherrie materializes out of thin air.
Der_Wanderer says, "[usefullness] ther are 2 other important aspects: on one
hand, at least in europe, the potential of electronic communication and
services is vastly underestimated and unknown."
tonami says, "About the interfaces:  I would like to see the horizontal text
continued but perhaps separated by an optional number of horizontal windows so
I could keep trck of conversations."
Wade says, "Okay, the way this works is that only three people (currently) may
speak at a time! When they're finished, they should type 'yield' so the next
person in the queue can be heard by the group."
Red_Guest materializes out of thin air.
Wade says, "Let the conversation continue!"
Daniel has arrived.
Peter says, "Let me restate my point of just now. People who are physically
isolated from the computing research community (eg. myself) can use the Net to
reach people in similar fields. Now, of course, you can use the standard Email
etc for that."
Redeen materializes out of thin air.
Der_Wanderer says, "[usefullness] thus, on one hand one cannot really expect
the MOOs to make up for this lack of education/knowledge in this regards"

>@who
Player name               Connected    Idle time    Location
-----------               ---------    ---------    --------
Mirror (#1351)            36 minutes   a second     Autumn Conference Room
Guest (#113)              6 minutes    4 seconds    Third Floor Atrium Landing
Bob (#882)                11 minutes   6 seconds    The E&L Garden
Ninja_Librarian (#1751)   33 minutes   9 seconds    Autumn Conference Room
Flame_Guest (#185)        30 minutes   10 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Turquoise_Guest (#358)    32 minutes   10 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Sharp (#1370)             57 minutes   12 seconds   Sharp's Forest
Polka_Dot_Guest (#320)    9 minutes    13 seconds   The E&L Garden
Wintermute (#1877)        54 minutes   13 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Paulie (#1831)            3 hours      15 seconds   Summer Conference Room
Daniel (#880)             43 minutes   17 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Indigo_Guest (#698)       24 minutes   18 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Red_Guest (#114)          59 seconds   28 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Wade (#535)               50 minutes   30 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Der_Wanderer (#1338)      27 minutes   32 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Redeen (#2169)            5 minutes    33 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Teal_Guest (#347)         23 minutes   34 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Peter (#915)              26 minutes   37 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Eric (#1855)              23 minutes   39 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Molly (#2180)             19 minutes   46 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
tonami (#1359)            31 minutes   48 seconds   Autumn Conference Room
Victor_L (#2195)          18 minutes   a minute     Autumn Conference Room
Sherrie (#1727)           11 minutes   a minute     Autumn Conference Room
Blue_Guest (#106)         21 minutes   a minute     Autumn Conference Room
CardiffMOO (#874)         8 hours      a minute     A Silent Place
Pink_Guest (#359)         18 minutes   a minute     Autumn Conference Room
adamfast (#2202)          19 minutes   a minute     Autumn Conference Room
Networker (#895)          5 minutes    a minute     Autumn Conference Room
Ralph124C41 (#1838)       39 minutes   a minute     Autumn Conference Room
ELF (#2174)               30 minutes   2 minutes    Autumn Conference Room
Pierre (#1736)            37 minutes   2 minutes    Autumn Conference Room
PaulB (#1373)             30 minutes   2 minutes    Autumn Conference Room
JaysHouseMOO (#1375)      9 hours      2 minutes    Orbiting MediaMOO
Orange_Guest (#344)       33 minutes   2 minutes    Autumn Conference Room
Oracle (#553)             an hour      11 minutes   Summer Conference Room

Total: 35 players, 34 of whom have been active recently.

ELF says, "What about problems for non-technical scholars (like me)"
Der_Wanderer says, "[usefullness] on the other hand, the MOO certainly can act
as an attractive example of the new kinds of interactions possible..."
Paulie materializes out of thin air.
Orange_Guest goes home.
ELF says, "So far discussion has pretty esoteric and technical"
Peter says, "But an interactive environment gives you a much better forum to
meet people. Eg. I met Greg Searle here, when we were both Guests. He is
interested in networking in the third world, so am I. He put me through to
Brian Gardner, a researcher in South Africa I did not know anything about."
Victor_L drops Video Camera.
Victor_L turns on camera to begin recording. . .
tonami says, "I think a better interface could only help solve some of the
problems encounteed ty the non-technical scholars"
Pink_Guest says, "I think that IRC is  amore simple way of communicating
without all of the environment to confuse or get in the way"
Daniel goes home.
tonami says, "The better interface combined with the MOO's ability to support
real-time and interactive conversations has a lot of potential application in
the humanities"
Wade says, "I think people should limit themselves to one or two comments, and
then yield."
Der_Wanderer [-> ELF] don't you see Moos as a first step towards making
electronic communication more attractive for non-comp-scientists? The way
information services such as gopher are embedded - just to make an example -
really looks like one of the very few alternatives that are available to a
broader public as of now.
Pink_Guest says, "I think you'll find the better interface within IRC"
>moderate
Wade is the current moderator.
The maximum number of speakers is 3.
Turquoise_Guest says, "meeting people is one thing (and a valuable thing).  But
this conferencing so far is pretty tough!"
Peter says, "Sure you can use IRC. However, MOO has a couple of advantages. 1:
You don't have as much of a problem with rogue elements. Every IRC channel has
to have a set up of ops, particularly the controversial ones."
Der_Wanderer [-> pink] I must admit I do not know too much about IRC, but to my
mind there you run the risk of making a traditional mistake in comp sci: you
isolate yourself from other related developments! (or can you easily integrate
WAIS/gopher etc. functionality in IRC?)
Peter says, "Something about MOO makes that less of a problem. Then, there is
the seperation into rooms. It helps a lot if conversation gets too tough... as
you can see."
tonami to Pink_Guest:  But, the IRC has absolutely no context!  It's the
context that creates the virtual reality , and it can be seen as getting in the
way or settng the stage depending on the perspective
Peter says, "Then there is the fact that a MOO is like a home. It is permanent,
you have your little room. The MediaMOO idea of building your RL place is
excellent. Basically, you can introduce people to who you are RL..."
Pink_Guest says, "why is it necessary to create a virtual reality when the Inet
by existence is already one"
Pink_Guest says, "there are permanent channels on IRC"
Blue_Guest goes out.
Peter says, "And finally, there is the programmability. Firstly, it gives the
idea of Work Done, and Work Being Done, and secondly the tools (simple things
like to and @research, more complicated things like cameras and @netpage) are
useful."
Pink_Guest says, "I believe the less context we put in the way, the easier
communication will be"
PaulB says, "The fundemental difference between IRC and a MOO is the ability
not to creat a virtual environemnt but the ability to program objects that add
to the utility of the conversation."
Peter [to Pink_Guest]: The Net may be a Virtual Reality. But it is not a human
reality.
Peter says, "Anyway, over to the next speaker."
Indigo_Guest goes out.
PaulB says, "It is only about creating context on the surface level. At a
deeper level it is about exploring new paradigms for collaboration and
communication."
Paulie has disconnected.
Eric says, "I've using irc for over a year, moos for -gosh- well over a week
now (so I can speak with AUTHORITY"
adamfast says, "irc has evolved some pretty good clients over the years..."
adamfast says, "i think the evolution with MOOs should continue with zest!"
Redeen goes out.
Victor_L turns off the camera. . .
Victor_L picks up Video Camera.
Eric says, "seems to me they are not mutually exclusive domains. irc IS easier
if fast verbal jazzing is what you want"
Victor_L goes out.
Flame_Guest goes out.
Eric says, "but it is harder, esp for nontech people, to GET to. They have
trouble taking advantage of all the available clients, and telnet"
Victor_L has arrived.
Eric says, "to irc is woefully inadequate. so moos are easier to get to,
virtually homier, and offer a complement to the headlong zip of irc"
Wade says, "I would be happy if we could talk about whether people in the
HUMANITIES in particular will be helped by this medium. Let's cut down on the
technical talk about aspects of the Internet for a minute, and think about
whether this medium is good for doing history, sociology, anthropology, etc. --
or just for fostering communication between historians, sociologists, etc."
Turquoise_Guest goes out.
Eric says, "I think. and I should yield now, but the role these spaces have for
humanities types is what I am most interested in. oh well."
Bob has arrived.
Polka_Dot_Guest has arrived.
The housekeeper arrives to cart Paulie off to bed.
Ralph124C41 has disconnected.
Jade_Guest has arrived.
tonami says, "Librarians are most often classified in the humanities ... and
I'm sure in these times of budget cuts that the MOO and it's conferencing
abilities will be ofgreat use for librarians and their national committee work"
tonami says, "I can also see that our instructional means will be significantly
altered usin the MOO"
Der_Wanderer says, "especially for the non-technicals I see a fundamental
importance in making *many* tools available, apart from "mere" discussion: I
think there is a qualitative difference, if you can do collaborative work over
big distances, using tools, sharing the results, etc. "
tonami says, "I agree with Der_Wanderer, I'd like to see an edit that allows
two or more people to use at the same time like the gopherhole at JH"
Ralph124C41 has connected.
Der_Wanderer nods - the important thing is to interview the non-comp-sci's and
try to implement what they see as fundamental needs - it is vital to get them
to *use* the moos as soon as possible!
Pink_Guest says, "I think the aopportunity to gain new perspectives through
communication is the key factor"
Der_Wanderer (technical aside before yielding -> it would be helpful to be
warned about the upcoming turn (i.e. to have a display each time you move up in
the queue...))
Reverend materializes out of thin air.
Peter says, "OK. We must consider the MOO from a couple of perspectives."
Purple_Guest has arrived.
Wintermute says, "I'd like to make the discussion a bit more concrete.
Certainly this technology COULD do any number of things, but it would be good
right now to know what people are USING it for.  For me, as for Peter, its the
contact with people from all..."
Purple_Guest takes another sip of coffee. .
Purple_Guest takes another sip of coffee. .
FreeSide has arrived.
Peter says, "Firstly, as I was talking about, connection. Secondly, resource
management... the gopher holes, etc. (but that falls more under a One United
Net) Thirdly, people are missing the chance to integrate Comp.Sci and
non.Comp.Sci"
Wintermute says, "over the world that's great; everything else is either fun,
diverting, or not yet very useful."
Peter says, "Its a pretty friendly atmosphere. People teach each other
things... try and help each other."
Ninja_Librarian says, "I can only type 1 1/2 lines at a time, so please excuse
my choppy comments.                                                         "
ELF goes out.
Ninja_Librarian says, "I subscribe to several discussion lists but have never
contributed.  This MOO is much more personal."
Pierre goes out.
Wintermute says, "One more thing before I yield:  I think that the critical
variables that will shape how this technology is used, and how it affects our
work, will be SOCIAL ones-- how many of us use the system, what place we make
for it in our professional lives--"
Wintermute says, "rather than the TECHNOLOGICAL ones."
Ninja_Librarian says, "In only 2 weeks I have met people and talked to people
(it is hard NOT to participate when people talk first to you."
Amy materializes out of thin air.
Ninja_Librarian says, "I like the combined info/bulletin board/meeting
place/conversation aspect of the MOO."
Eric says, "I like Peter's interest in connection across discplines. The
friendliness of this MOO is almost an ideal for making those bridges"
Ninja_Librarian says, "I think the MOO has great possibilities for humanities
studies people."
Eric says, "I'm in a community--computers and writing--that is *very*
interested (and successful) at promoting that kind of integration"
Eric says, "But the general composition/rhetoric (and maybe all humanities)
scholars are filled with equal portions fascination and fear"
Wade says, "I'm curious about the SOCIAL factors Wintermute mentioned. What
kinds of SOCIAL factors prevent people in the humanities from using systems
like this one?"
Eric says, "when it comes to actually working in virtual space. "
Wade says, "I'd like to hear people's speculations about that."
PaulB says, "before responding to Wades' new query I'd like to comment on the
previous thred."
Eric says, "Wade: part of it is tradition, social conditioning if you will.
Many humanists were raised to distrust machines"
Lavender_Guest materializes out of thin air.
PaulB says, "Radio Broadcasting was quiteliterally invented by the audience.
the technology proceeded it and the paradigm was invented people playing around
just like here"
Eric says, "they grasp nostalgically at aging reading/writing technology
(print) and feel sort of culturally assaulted when some of us suggest"
PaulB says, "I think fostering communication is enough. A ferment of uses will
naturally and intuitively spring out of the interaction. That's hwat the TV
project is really about."
Eric says, "that exploring new territory is not necessarily a rejection of
humanist heritage"
Ochre_Guest materializes out of thin air.
Cerulean_Guest materializes out of thin air.
PaulB says, "as for social factors it is partially an age distinction more than
perhaps a discipline one. Future humanities people will use computing more than
their current counterparts."
FreeSide goes out.
Pink_Guest goes out.
Ralph124C41 says, "Moos are great as a glorified BBs and wonderful for comp sci
people. and as an object of study for sociologists. but they are not the way
historians et. al. do their work and hence they're unlikely to see them of
value."
PaulB says, "I'd like to stage a MOO play purely as an experiment in MOO
perfomance art."
Gray_Guest has arrived.
Ralph124C41 says, "eric, i think the old saw about distrust is too simplistic."
Molly flattens out into a largish 29 cent postage stamp and floats away.
PaulB says, "I don't think you can seperate communication from work. If
historians can use a MOO to communicate, then they will learn to use it as an
extension of their work"
Ice materializes out of thin air.
Reverend has disconnected.
A largish 29 cent postage stamp floats into the room and fattens up into Molly.

>speakers
Victor_L, PaulB, and Ralph124C41 are the current speakers.

Ralph124C41 has disconnected.
Purple_Guest goes out.
Der_Wanderer says, "re: pink "gain new perspectives through communications: the
only way to gain them is to *use* the communication tools! (but that's a minor
point)..."
PaulB says, "I think if english scholars and historians will perceive this as
useful then it will become useful...the only hump is the initial perception..."
Der_Wanderer says, "(sorry for the delay, but I find it hard to jump right in
once the bell rings)"
Wade says, "What Ralph says about historians not doing their work this way is
true, but isn't it inevitable that some kind of virtual interaction will become
important among humanities scholars? In other words, is it possible that the
resistance will wane over time, just as it did with e-mail?"
Ralph124C41 has connected.
Molly goes home.
Der_Wanderer says, "re: wintermute "I have been talking, helping" -> we have to
AUGMENT the array of tools available in the MOO: the non-comp-sci want to use
it to achieve *other* goals!"
Polka_Dot_Guest goes out.
Bob goes out.
Ice goes home.
Der_Wanderer says, "it is necessary to enable users of the MOO to accomplish
other tasks, simply talking to each other is really only a fundamental
prerequisite."
The housekeeper arrives to cart Reverend off to bed.
Peter says, "Look, the problem is this: the goals of the MOO are defined by its
constructioin,"
Der_Wanderer says, "re: wintermute "->SOCIAL future" <- *you* can *form* the
future by contributing now! I really don't think we can afford to wait for
other developments to come to our aids - we must create the needs!"
Peter says, "And the other way round basically. However, to construct you need
to program. Thus we need a better way to construct for non-comp.sci.s. I
believe this is Paul's field... unfortunately he is not here."
Jade_Guest goes out.
Der_Wanderer says, "finally, I fully agree with ralph (and I don't think Eric
really meant it that way)-> it is obvious that many tasks today can still be
done more efficiently with pencil and rubber than with a computer! of course
the picture is slowly changing, but..."
PaulB says, "I think for the Humanities people and non-comp-sci we ought to not
overlook fun aspects of the MOO"
PaulB says, "You don't know how many people have gone joy-riding in the copter
since cdr built it."
Ralph124C41 says, "Peter is right. MOOS are now an object for the humanities
but not perceived at present as being part of or an aid to their work""
Der_Wanderer says, "... among other things, to my experience, non-comp-sci are
scared by the very short persistance of items in the comp-sci field -> you have
to learn how to do the most basic things over and over again! the moo perhaps
finally is abstracted far enough from the underlying tools to hide the changing
technicalities from the non-comp-sci users."
PaulB says, "it is the goofing which serves an important socializing
purpose.Only later do most users begin to be aware of the serious purposes that
can derive from this environment"
Der_Wanderer says, "btw, I do not really think it is such a great idea to have
non-comp-sci's do comp-sci work (but that of course is a matter of where to
draw the line...)"
Ralph124C41 says, "compuer science is much too important to be left to the
computer scientists!"
tonami says, "GUI + object icons = a kind of build-your-own-salad bar for the
non-programmer among us ..."
Ralph124C41 says, "i have to go. i'd just add this weas a good start and it
should be continued."
PaulB says, "Well, let's all invite a humanites friend to the MOO and see what
happens."
Cerulean_Guest has disconnected.
Gray_Guest goes out.
Ochre_Guest has disconnected.
tonami says, "It seems like with the object orientation, it would help if some
of the most common tasks, verbs, etc were pre-cofigured and I could just put
them together wth point and click to make what I wanted to help me in my work
..."
Oracle has arrived.
PaulB says, "I am taking requests for what ought to be the fisrt MOO play ever
to initiate serious humanities activities. I'm looking at Rosencrantz and
Guildenstern are dead."
tonami says, "Now, I'm trying to learn how to program and, whew, it's rough
going ..."
Flame_Guest has arrived.
Wade says, "The FORUM was only scheduled to go on for an hour, but I am willing
to stay and continue moderating for a while if people want to keep talking!"
Peter says, "PaulB, that's great. Your and cdr's MOO TV has already been a
great influence."
Peter says, "However, its still kinda difficult to use for non-computer
scientists."
Wade says, "I would like to ask the humanities people present to speak up a
little more. For instance, what kinds of reactions do you get from your
colleagues when you try to explain what you are doing on MediaMOO?"
adamfast says, "a couple of comments...."
Peter says, "Now, I think that everyone realises the generalised benefits of
the Net. The benefits of moo are a bit more difficult to explain."
adamfast says, "i have a friend and colleague with me now."
Peter says, "And they will remain innaccessible to non programmers till we have
a more accessible interface."
Silver_Guest has arrived.
Peter says, "Adam, allow me one more statement and I'll shut up...."
adamfast says, "he is very interested in this MOO concept, but agrees they are
very primitive...."
Ralph124C41 has disconnected.
Flame_Guest goes out.
adamfast says, "i will bring more humanities people here..."
Ninja_Librarian goes out.
Wintermute says, "I'm an historian, and will presume to speak for my
profession...."
PaulB has disconnected.
Peter says, "Strangely, I find that MUSH is easier to learn in than MOO....
even though MOO is a "cleaner" system."
Peter says, "This might be because it is very self-contained."
tonami says, "As a librarian, I think many of my colleagues look at me with
some degree of tolerant amusement wwhen I talk about MOO, others think I'm a
techno-nut ..."
Wintermute says, ""I've noticed a couple things among my people: not to many of
us are Internet users yet (though younger people are, in small numbers) and
perhaps more interesting, the FAMOUS people don't use Internet..."
Wintermute says, "...or other electronic communications resources.  If you're
famous, people call or write YOU."
Eric says, "Know what you mean. Techno-nut is how folks around here would
describe me, too"
Oracle says, "Has anyone mentioned the difficulty of managing multiple-thread
converstaions, without the usual face-to-face visual cues for deciding speaking
order?"
Jade_Guest has arrived.
Oracle says, "These problems exist fot all chat-like systems (moos included)"
adamfast has disconnected.
Eric says, "MOO usually results in *very* clever  bovine jokes when I bring it
up. And vacant looks. And some suspicion."
Oracle says, "At least MOOs offer the possibility of expermintation in this
area."
Peter says, "Of course, Michele's to command helps a lot in conversations. It
should be part of the standard character."
Eric says, "yeah, oracle, that's a problem. But in writing studies it shouldn't
be. Ever seen a facial expression in rhetoric journal article?"
Der_Wanderer says, "aren't we getting a bit too technical again?"
Eric says, "me either. "
Der_Wanderer says, "(but then again, the official part is sort of over now,
no?)"
The housekeeper arrives to cart Ralph124C41 off to bed.
Pierre has arrived.
Lavender_Guest has disconnected.
The housekeeper arrives to cart PaulB off to bed.
Wintermute says, "I think it COULD become useful to historians in a couple
obvious ways: holding meetings, conferences, that kind of thing.  But so much
of humanities research is a solitary kind of thing, I'm skeptical that very
different kinds of communication...."
Wade says, "What about other aspects of MUDs, aside from chatting? Is it a good
location for collaboration on serious projects? Or for information gathering?
Or will these options simply remain unused until the interface is easier?"
Wintermute says, "...will emerge and crystallize around MOOs for us."
Eric says, "one problem I've encountered as a humanist-type: people sometimes
think I'm *not doing any work* when I'm on the net"
Eric says, "they have no framework in which to value work in this environment."
Flatlander has arrived.
Peter says, "Eric: and what framework is there outside MOO besides that of your
peers?"
Eric says, "wade: so happens I've been working on a conference workshop
proposal with three other colleagues here for the past few days"
Wintermute says, "I think it COULD be useful for collaboration.  Information
gathering is another subject-- there aren't many resources available here yet."
Peter says, "Wade: what type of work? The building of MOO is of course a
research project in itself."
Ninja_Librarian materializes out of thin air.
Eric says, "and we've gotten a lot more done than we could have using email (we
think, anyway)"
The housekeeper arrives to cart adamfast off to bed.
Purple_Guest has arrived.
tonami says, "The MOO can be a good place for information gathering ... check
out the Infocenter here for the standard references ... I'd like to see the
telnet part of th gopherslate enabled so I could provide access to even more
information"
tonami says, "But, the collaberative work won't happen until there's some
editing tool that aloows more than one user at a time ..."
Der_Wanderer says, "re: wade 'aspects of MUDs, aside from chatting' -> this is
the point I have been trying to make this evening: real-time communication is
essential as it is qualitatively different from batch-style e-mail (see
well-known examples of BOEING reunions using terminals...) but..."
Barry materializes out of thin air.
Eric says, "yes, (if I got the question right) the frameworks for applying
value are dependent on context. My online peers have higher regard    "
tonami says, "The collaberative editing tool would allow 1) simultaneous
viewing and editing 2) cutting an dpasting from MOO resources i.e. in the
Infocenter"
Eric says, "for moos than folks in the next office."
Der_Wanderer says, "...to my mind the true role of the Moo is that of a
subtrate upon which to build (running the risk of repeating myself) -> I don't
see the priority for a non-comp-sci in toying around with the moo, but, e.g.
being able to do a whole job together, from research through assembling the
retrieved pieces to producing the final result and "publishing" it on the net!"
cdr has arrived.
Silver_Guest has disconnected.
Der_Wanderer says, "(I'll yield after next statement)"
Peter says, "About simultaneous editing: that is a need on and off MOO."
Peter says, "Basically the collabrative stuff being said is like the normal
idea of groupware"
Der_Wanderer [>]: Peter yes, but moo has the potential of providing a better
general interface! there *are* inherent limitations to purely graphical user
interfaces!
tonami hates it when people don't think non-comp-sci people should play, too
... she just wants to have some different toys to play with than the standard
issue
Peter said nothing about GUI's.
Peter says, "So, can we start summarizing some conclusions we reached?"
Wade says, "I don't want to imply that humanists shouldn't be allowed to play
in the MOO environment. I certainly have had a lot of fun building things
here!..."
Peter says, "One conclusion I've reached: We need a better client."
Wade says, "But I think the long-term goals of anyone who spends a lot of time
MUDding ought to include professional development of some kind. At least, that
should be an option! "
Peter says, "Another: We need to pursue our discussions here."
Wade says, "What do people think about that?"
Peter says, "Wade: Surely, yes."
tonami says, "Wade, please explain professional development in the context of
the MOO""
Wintermute says, "I agree that we need a better client, AND we'll have to make
this a kind of professional development."
Peter says, "But we must ask if there is much difference between work and
play?"
tonami says, "Darn good question ..."
Wintermute says, "Peter, if you're lucky there's not much difference; maybe we
should think about the difference between PRODUCTIVE work/play vs.
nonproductive?"
Wade says, "Tonami, I'm talking about being able to do things that enhance or
further your career in some way. Chatting with colleagues can certainly be part
of that, but there are many other phases of work that could also be facilitated
by some kind of virtual interactions..."
tonami nods
Wintermute says, "Anyway, one example of professional development would be to
organize virtual conferences like this one.  Its been an interesting
experience."
Wade says, "One problem preventing humanists from using this medium might be
that they are, by nature, loners. They don't want or need to work around other
people!, at least when they are producing their stock-in-trade, which is
scholarly articles."
Wintermute goes out.
Teal_Guest goes out.
tonami goes out.
Jade_Guest goes out.
Peter says, "My comment about work an play was of course influenced by my
belief in the possibility of a Zero Work society."
Wade says, "I guess things are winding down! I have to go soon. If anyone else
wants to take up the job of moderating, please whisper something to me!"
Eric says, "wade: I think that 'loner' bit is waning. collaboration, at least
in comp/rhet studies, is booming"
Peter must go soon too.
Pierre goes out.
Peter says, "The loner thing makes no sense in an information age,"
Eric says, "wintermute: I could talk the rest of the day about your suggestion.
But for now, just YES!!!!"
Jade_Guest has arrived.
Peter says, "Memes which do not spread will die..."
Flatlander goes out.
Der_Wanderer says, "I agree with eric, I do not know about the situation in the
US , but in Europe it is still very common that when someone from the
humanities applies for computer equipment at the computing centre they are put
off with the statement 'what for???'"
Ninja_Librarian goes out.
Wade is now the moderator.
Maximum number of speakers set to 4
Flatlander has arrived.
Flatlander goes out.
Peter says, "DW: That is changing it seems."
Peter says, "Most of the resistance I have (as a comp. sci.) is non-comp. sci."
Der_Wanderer says, "without any mentioning of the fact that the comp centers
are far too concerned about managing their limited resources to even consider
spreading the word abotut what is available in the internet!!!"
Eric says, "still happens in the US too, wanderer, but it's changing. I have a
pretty good relationship with computing people on our campus"
Peter says, "people who think I want to turn them into machine ruled zombies."
Eric says, "they are very interested in cooperative projects, and we've got a
few going"
Peter says, "Do we still need a conference room for the far less people? Shall
we not move back to summer?"
Wade says, "I have to go now! Who would like to moderate in my place?"
Wade says, "Peter, it's all yours!"
Wade is no longer the moderator.
Wade says, "Peter, just type 'moderate' and the number of speakers you would
like to be able to speak at once."
Peter is now the moderator.
Wade says, "I'm going to yield now and go home!"
Networker goes home.
Wade says, "Thanks for coming, everyone!"
Flatlander has arrived.
Guest has arrived.
Flame_Guest has arrived.
Peter says, "Thanks Wade."
Wade goes out.
Eric says, "yeah, this was a great idea"
Peter says, "What are the votes on going to the Summer Room? Whisper to me..."
cdr goes out.
Flame_Guest goes out.
Eric says, "I should probably go, too, so you all have a good evening..."
Peter decides that due to a lack of interest, he is moving, so if anyone
follows, fine.
Peter is no longer the moderator.
Red_Guest goes home.
Eric goes out.
Peter turns off the camera. . .
Peter picks up Peter's Camera.
cdr has arrived.
Peter goes out.
cdr turns off the camera. . .